Dear readers of the Jackrail,
A french colleague is looking for an English or French translation of Mattheson’s Grosse General Bass Schule).
Thank you for your suggestions,
Best wishes to everybody, on this day, which is probably the first of a long tragedy
Aline Zylberajch
Envoyé de mon iPhone
This is the closest I could find, a PhD thesis:
Appears to have translation of volumes 2 and 3. From 1956. How good the translation is I have no idea.
Microform - but I can get international loans via the State Library of Victoria and can scan to PDF.
A french colleague is looking for an English or French translation of Mattheson’s Grosse General Bass Schule).
I don’t think this was ever translated into French or English.
A good excuse for your colleague to learn German.
Le 24/02/2022 08:34, Andrew Bernard via The Jackrail écrit :
This is the closest I could find, a PhD thesis:
Appears to have translation of volumes 2 and 3. From 1956. How good the translation is I have no idea.
Microform - but I can get international loans via the State Library of Victoria and can scan to PDF.
Volumes 2 and 3 are the exercises with comments, 24 in each. The main
text (some 200 pages) is in volume 1.
It’s learn German then for all of us!
I have the facsimile (on IMSLP) and I observe it is vast with very tightly cramped Fraktur text. It’s a large work.
Of interest:
I had seen references to this work but never checked it out. It seems, based on M. Dijoux’s comments, that this is much more than a manual of how to play chords to implement the given figures – very interesting! Unfortunately my German is limited and trying to work through 200 pages of dense fraktur is not appealing.
Just had a look at the IMSLP Mattheson treatise. It is really quite clearly printed and not too difficult to read. At aprox. 400 pages, I am not sure how much I want to become involved with this work. Still it would be interesting to spend some time on it and see what comes out of it. Some of it looks quite fun if a bit quaint from the language.
Regards,
Andrew Wedman
That’s revelatory! This Jean Christophe Dijoux I didn’t know before but he is great.
Is there any link between Mattheson and the Partimenti authors? Partimenti is for composing but then the realization of the continuo is a composition. Mr Dijoux doesn’t seem to use much of stereotypical formulas typical of the partimenti.
By the way, what is the relation between the Grosse generalbass schule and the Kleine generalbass schule? Editio minor/maior? Enlarged edition? Two independent works?
I am asking because Armelin editions has published an Italian translation of the Kleine schule which could be more immediate than the original for some (for me certainly, of course).
Dom
The kleine schule in Italian translation is here:
https://www.armelin.it/CollanaIeC/017.htm
The thesis by Reddick which Andrew has pointed to seems to be unavailable through UMI Research Press (that I believe they are no more in business) but it seems downloadable from San Diego State University: https://csu-sdsu.primo.exlibrisgroup.com/discovery/search?query=any,contains,Harvey%20reddick&tab=Everything&search_scope=MyInst_and_CI&vid=01CALS_SDL:01CALS_SDL&offset=0
The only drawback is that an email address from the San Diego Uni is needed. So I couldn’t download it.
If somebody (Andrew maybe?) succeeds in downloading or microform scanning or whatever, would you please tell me?
Dom
Interesting playing. But does Mattheson really want the Presto with repeated 1/16th notes in the bass to be accompanied by repeated 1/16th note chords in the RH? And are all the pieces intended to be realised by solo harpsichord without a bass string instrument? I have always thought that throroughbass was for ensemble playing.
David
From Oxford Music Online:
Among the other valuable works by Mattheson, one must cite the Grosse General-Bass-Schule (1731), an expanded version of the earlier Exemplarische Organisten-Probe (1719). These books give organists valuable assistance in learning how to improvise from a given bass, an ability vital to the daily musical responsibilities of organists at this period. The 48 examples, with Mattheson’s extensive comments on their realization, are particularly important. The Kleine General-Bass-Schule (1735) takes up the other aspect of improvisation, the realization of a thoroughbass part, but (in distinction to the earlier two works) in the role of an accompanist, not as soloist.
Here’s a digital edition of the 24 probestücke:
Since finding the digital edition above, and not speaking German myself, I ran a bit through Google translate, always an amusing exercise. As one poster said, the language appears to be very quaint, but with a very unique style.
For number 11:
Wie wird dem Herrn Organist zu Mute? Es sieht hier ein wenig bunt wieder aus; hat aber so viel nicht zu sagen, als man meinet. Das Ding lässt sich halten, wenn man_es nur recht übersieht; es fällt ja alles so schön in die Hand, daß es eine Lust ist. Nur frisch daran; wer wagt, der gewinnt; um eine Probe ist es zu tun. Der Ton ist ja bekannt, der Takt drei Viertel, die Schlüssel nichts, als Bass, Tenor und Alt; warum sollte man sich dafür fürchten? Wiewohl ich erinnere mich, der Herr spielt nicht gern nach gedruckten Noten; es ist wahr, wenn man es nicht gewohnt; das Papier scheinet auch etwas durchzuschlagen; er nehme es mit nach Hause, und lasse es rein abschreiben, das Ding verdienet es wohl; es hat einer gemacht, von dem der Herr gehöret, er könne oder wolle auch ja komponieren; morgen kommen wir wieder zusammen.
How does the organist feel? It looks a little colorful here again; but doesn’t say as much as you think. The thing can be held, if one just surveys it properly; everything falls into one’s hand so beautifully that it is a pleasure. Just fresh at it; who dares wins; to do a rehearsal. The tone is well known, the measure three quarters, the clefs nothing but bass, tenor and alto; why should one fear it? Although I remember, the gentleman does not like to play from printed music; it’s true if you’re not used to it; the paper also seems to bleed through; he’ll take it home and have it copied clean, the thing well deserves it; someone did it, of whom the gentleman heard that he could or would also compose; tomorrow we will meet again.
I observe that, of course, the gentleman does not like to play from printed music.
The digital edition allows one to switch between original and modern clefs, which may be useful for people.
More from Grove:
Mattheson’s books are written in a difficult, exceedingly prolix style requiring considerable expertise in the German language. Very little from these texts is available in English and the definitive study of his treatises remains to be written. For the student of German Baroque music, however, they are a source of inestimable value, musical documents of unique importance to the history of 18th-century music in Germany.
Thanks a lot, Andrew. Now I begin to understand why the Mattheson treatises haven’t been translated entirely yet. 
In the website you linked to, http://probstuecke-digital.de/index.html, there is a button “English” with an English translation for each of the probestuck.
However after seeing the video by mr Dijoux I was convinced Mattheson showed some alternative ways of melodically realizing the bass, something like the later Partimenti, but this is not the case.
D
Of course, Mattheson does not write modern German; but I do not find the original text as quaint as the Google translation makes it, by translating too much word for word, rather than understanding the different idiom of German and translating it for what it means. That’s one reason why it’s called artificial intelligence!
David
It was a poster here @TonmeisterAW that described it as quaint.
Google translate I find pretty hopeless. I showed it more because I thought Google’s effort was amusing, more than anything else.
Spell check can also be pretty bizarre. The Fearless Leader of the Medieval/Renaissance group I play in makes us copies of the concert program after running spellcheck…hilarious!